My son is a junior. He had a 3.0 GPA in freshman year; because of this we set him up with private tutoring in most of his subjects for his sophomore year. This helped him improve his sophomore year GPA to 3.4. We continued the private tutoring for junior year, but in his first semester of junior year he received 2 B-'s, 2 B’s, and 1 A-. He took 2 AP’s in freshman year but since then has not taken any AP’s. He studies all day, on weekends he’ll frequently do homework for more than 8 hours a day. He’s expressed to us that he is very unhappy because he has no time to do anything outside of school and is considering going to Community College. My husband does not want him to go to a community college, but I don’t think my son’s grades reflect his potential - see, my daughter was a ‘low ability’ student. She scored 1290 on the SAT and had a GPA of 4.3 and is now happy at a decent school majoring in journalism. My son scored 1510 on the Practice SAT without having studied, and then scored 1580 on the SAT with minimal studying. When my son was IQ tested he scored at more than 3 standard deviations above the mean, so clearly his grades should not be in the bottom quartile of his school. I do not believe he has any learning disability either. He was evaluated for ADHD as a child and does not have it. He does not have dyslexia either, he was reading at a high school reading level in Kindergarten. I am very unhappy seeing him get bad grades because he had so much potential as a child and he works so hard. Thanks all.
There is a lot to address in this post, and honestly, your son’s B- is the least of the issues. Based solely on your comments about low ability, bad grades, and community college, I suspect that there is some unwanted stress being put on him. Please be careful.
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Have a meeting with each of his teachers to determine what points he is losing (test points, homework points, discussion participation points, attendance points etc.)
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Get full formal neuropsych testing (you may end up having to pay this out of pocket.)
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No more than 2 hours of homework on any day, no matter what. He is studying too much and it isn’t helping.
I just want to emphasize this. Kids can be extremely smart, but have “learning disabilities“ that are not things you might normally think of.
For instance, my oldest is extremely smart, and it has always been obvious that he is. I won’t go into all the details, but we did realize in his teens he was “mildly“ on the autism spectrum. When we got a full formal neuropsych evaluation done to get a diagnosis for that, the psychologist also discovered that he has “slow processing speed.“ That is not something I would have ever guessed because I think of him as being very quick. But she explained the ways it can show up in his work, and those lined up with what we experience with him.
Definitely get the full neuropsych done!
I second a full neuropsych evaluation.
Spending 8+ hours “studying” for a kid that is scoring 1500+ on aptitude test with no improvement in grades sounds like ADHD- inattentive type (not hyperactive). It is sometimes missed in gifted young kids because they present none of the hyperactivity associated with ADHD.
He needs to cut down his studying time a lot for now. Talk to his teachers and coordinate with your pediatrician to have the teachers fill out the evaluation forms.
Edit to add - saw same with my son. Gifted but due to ADHD (inattentive type) was taking 4+hours to do 30 min assignments. With diagnosis and help he is now thriving.
He shouldn’t be studying for eight hours a day. His weekends are shot. You know it’s not all about the grades.
If he doesn’t have any extracurricular activities or participation in sports or clubs, then even if he had perfect grades, anyone would question why he didn’t do anything besides study.
I’ve been a participant in thousands of team evaluations with neuro-psych evals. It’s eye-opening. If he’s bright, and is showing it on tests, then some thing else is going on.
+1 for getting a private neuropsych evaluation.
And agree that he needs to get something in his life other than schoolwork.
This is where “fit” is so important.
He is clearly intelligent.
May be find a school that suits him is going to benefit him in the long run?
Something is very not right. Kid either has a learning disability, slow processing speed, or ADHD.
Full neuropsych with a well-trained person who knows what they’re doing. A lot of psychologists bill themselves as neuropsych, when they’re not.
Meanwhile, I suspect that when this kid finds what he likes, he’ll do very well in it. Not the end of the world if he goes to your local public college.
I agree an evaluation might be needed.
But I also think this kid needs to be given some time to do some things he enjoys. Some kids really come into their own when doing fun things that are of high interest to them. With the amount of time spent on tutoring and homework, this simply is not possible.
So, yes, find out IF there is something getting in the way of him learning more efficiently, but also let him have some fun.
He needs some balance in his life. It can’t be all about getting the best grades so he can attend some college.
Do you look at the work that is being graded? Are the grades due to missing or incomplete assignments? Is it homework, tests, or both that he is struggling with? One subject or multiple subjects? I think we all know intelligence doesn’t always correlate to top grades in high school so something else is going on. Good luck.
Please please listen to this part. No student should be spending this much time on academics only.
Adding, there is nothing wrong with Community College.
Definitely try and get a neuropsychological evaluation. My oldest son was unofficially diagnosed in 6th grade by his pediatrician, inattentive, that we watched but didn’t act on until his math grades started to go down. When talking to his teacher, she told us he was just making silly mistakes, but he definitely knew the material. Started medication, improved right away (this was unexpected). Junior year of HS, bunch of AP classes, turned out he was having bad executive function issues. His guidance counselor helped him once a week with a sit down mapping out his assignments (I thought he was just being lazy, nope). We had our other son evaluated for other reasons, he has no signs of ADHD, which is what I expected. My nephew had similar grades in HS, scored a 35 on the ACT and 1540 on the SAT, had a neuropsychological evaluation senior year, he’s now doing well in college with his ADHD meds. I’m not saying your son has ADHD, but you want to get to the bottom of it.
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I am having trouble understanding what is “low ability” about your daughter.
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I know this is hard, but please try not to compare your son and daughter in any way. They are two different people and very well could have very different needs.
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Someones SAT score should not define them as a person. It’s the whole package that matters.
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What things would your son like to do for fun…find out.
And yes, get a full evaluation done.
Please let your son have free time, have fun. His grades are fine.let him have fun, or volunteer, or play. He will have new confidence and happiness.
So important for mental health, avoiding depression or worse.
I’m a little stuck on how that much time studying isn’t showing results, so I’d take a very close look at the “why” behind his poor grades. Does he forget to hand things in? Fail to provide answers to questions actually asked/misread the assignments? Not refer to the rubric for an assignment? Forget facts? Not “get” concepts? They’re all pretty different issues that will have different solutions.
If he hasn’t already, your son should be attending each of his teachers’ office hours to see if they can help him pinpoint what he needs to do to improve.
Another thing to screen for is depression. My niece has always scored extremely high on standardized tests and was in gifted programs throughout school, but her grades in high school were not commensurate with her ability. She decompensated senior year and was diagnosed with severe depression but had not shown outward signs until then except for the lackluster grades. She needed to attend an intensive outpatient program while finishing her senior year online. She took a gap year and is now a college freshman. I think the possibility of undiagnosed ADHD is more likely for your son but make sure other conditions are also evaluated.
First…I am struggling to understand how your daughter is “low ability.”
I would get a neuropsych eval for your son. That would provide some useful information about what might be going in. I would also encourage him to put the books down and find time to participate in activities he enjoys (not suggesting you are not).
What does he like to do for fun? Does he have opportunities to socialize with friends?
The smarter a kid is the easier it can be to miss a learning disability because their intelligence often learns to compensate for weaker areas. Agree that you need a thorough evaluation. He is clearly smart, yet he studies 8 hours a day and gets B-s? There is clearly a hidden problem that a professional will need to hunt for.
In the meantime, let him have a life. Average grades are not the end of the world and studying all the time is not healthy for a teenager. He needs to get out of the house, hang out with friends, develop some hobbies, and let his grades land where they will while you also start looking into neuropsych issues. And if that means he does two years at community college, so what? There are worse things in the world. He can start there, get his issues worked out, then transfer to a four year and finish his degree, then take that anywhere he wants. There’s nothing wrong with that and, given the situation, might be the best solution all around.
I also express dismay about your labeling your daughter as “low ability.” What does that mean and why does it even matter if things have apparently worked out very well for her? If she is thriving, then let her thrive and let’s abandon these negative labels. She seems to be doing just fine and that’s what matters.
In our district the teachers have been attending trainings on SEL - social emotional learning. In short, the students’ brains won’t work as needed when they are in social or emotional distress or disturbance, which is not news. I was surprised to find out that the teachers of gifted and talented students are required to take extra training. Apparently the GT students need more help with social and emotional competencies to bring out their potential. I don’t mind taking these trainings but I wish the parents are taking them too.